Richard Baker Archives - Aberdeen Voice

Old Susannah No. 44 – Portraits, Papers And Parties

Aberdeen City, Articles, Community, Creative Writing, Environment, Information, Satire and Humour No Responses »

Jul 152011

Old Susannah looks back at the week that was and wonders who’s up to what and why. By Suzanne Kelly.

Tally Ho! First some good news this week: In a speech to graduating students, our very own Sir Ian Wood has said ‘his generation’ is responsible for many problems that the next generation will inherit. I suppose everyone who is in the great collective of people of his age have had equal power to improve the world as this particular billionaire oil magnate has.
Never before have so few done so much to get rid of a Victorian Garden. Fifty Million pounds – of his own money –pledged to building a parking lot with a bit of grass over it, conveniently adjacent to his friend Stew’s plot of land.

Could there be any better use for that kind of money?

I wonder how much of the remainder of his fortune will be used for the current African drought/famine crisis, to counteract poverty in the UK, to improve care for the elderly, to buy jewellery for attractive statuesque blondes. I hope everyone in Ian’s generation is sitting up and taking notice. It’s your fault – one of the richest men in your age bracket says so.

However, it is with a heavy heart and tears in my eyes that I must report that the News of the World has closed and the Murdoch takeover of BskyB is off. I have been crying over my pints of Brewdog for the last few days, so much so that people have mistakenly think I am laughing so hard I’m crying.

This must be quite a blow for Rup; at least he has his loving young wife Wendy and friend Tony Blair to comfort him (Tony and Rupert spoke quite a bit just before the UK joined in the Iraq takeover – sorry Iraq War). That nice Rebekah Brooks was photographed while being drive away from NotW HQ in a rain-spattered car; it reminded me of the photo of Maggie Thatcher tearfully leaving No. 10 – which also made me very sad indeed. Cheers!

They said he was ‘no oil painting’, but this has now been disproved.

Bad news close to home as well – one of our Labour Councillors is having a hard time over a dodgy old boiler (no, not you Kate). Councillor Hunter allegedly doesn’t have the correct credentials to fix gas boilers, which is rather unfortunate for someone who works fixing gas boilers.

The P&J had a splendid photo of Richard Baker, Labour MSP for the story it printed about Hunter. The picture of Baker’s caption had a scoop-of-the-year quote: “I know the man” Baker said. I take back everything I’d ever said about the Press & Journal now that they’ve uncovered local Labour politicians are known to each other. We should tell the authorities.

But at this rate I’ll not get on with any definitions, so here we go:

Public Spending:

(modern English phrase) Governmental use of funds to procure benefits, goods or services which may be of temporary or lasting significance, generally for the benefit of the public at large. See also Common Good fund, applicable in parts of Scotland.

There is more trouble in Paradise this week, I am sorry to say. Sadly, some people are being rather negative about our very own Lord Provost having his portrait commissioned. They said he was ‘no oil painting’, but this has now been disproved. This fantastic event will be justly commemorated with a joyous celebration, courtesy of The Common Good Fund.

What could be more reasonable? The portrait cost £9,000 (I guess we could not find any RGU graduates in need of a commission), and hopefully the Chain of Office in the painting will have been gold-leafed on by Italian craftsmen flown over for the purpose. I so look forward to attending this party!

I shall buy a new hat. I’m thinking of getting my own portrait done, and may well pop out to one of those photo canvas printing places in Union Square Mall or similar for the £39.95 photo on canvas.

After all, it’s Common Good money paying for the whole event – so I am taking this opportunity to tell everyone who pays taxes in Aberdeen to show up at the party. If the Council has any objection to us all enjoying the party we’re paying for, I invite them to get in touch with me.

From my point of view the portrait and party represent all the best of public spending: not only do we get a great party for our important citizens, but all of us will have a lasting reminder of the Lord Provost and all he has done for us. In a previous column I complained that our City Councillors no longer had the taxpayer paying for their beautiful photo Christmas cards – this expenditure more than makes up for my disappointment. I may suggest we do a statue as well; they are all the rage at present.

You would have thought with everything the LP (as his friend calls him) has done for Stewy and Ian, they would have clubbed together to pay for the bling portrait

Early rumours that a protest march will coincide with this monumental event are very disappointing.

I would hate to see marchers carrying pictures of our Lord Provost down Union Street on the day and/or holding a parallel party at some suitable venue. If I’ve been spotted buying paint, brushes and sign-making material, it is purely coincidental.

The cost of outfitting our Lord Provost and his wife for a year … £10,000

The cost of a portrait of our Lord Provost … £9,000

The cost of a party to celebrate the portrait … £4,000

The cost of a blonde woman to guard said Provost and his bling necklace … unknown

The cost of the Lord Provost casting the crucial tie-breaking vote that opened the floodgates on developing Union Terrace Gardens: PRICELESS

You would have thought with everything the LP (as his friend calls him) has done for Stewy and Ian, they would have clubbed together to pay for the bling portrait. After all, one good turn deserves another, and what are friends for?

Whistleblower:

(modern English noun) a person who is aware of public or private sector corruption, malpractice or unlawful act(s) who comes forward to expose it.

Private Eye’s current issue has an excellent work concerning NHS whistleblowers and how badly they have been treated – and how vital their whistleblowing has been. If you get the chance, please do pick it up.

Here in Aberdeen obviously there is nothing going on in government which needs any exposure. All invoices are always above board, every councillor declares their interest in advance of any relevant vote, land deals are always done to get best market value, and everything’s just rosy.

As I touched on last week, the City has written to its employees to warn them not to use ‘social networking websites’ to make any comment about their managers or the Council. Many of you have sent me copies of your letters – after all the letters are not marked ‘confidential’ – so why not? You have been wondering what is or is not appropriate to post on websites or ‘disclosing in any medium’. Here’s the Council’s sage advice from those letters (asterisks are mine):-

“to clarify what is regarded as unacceptable*, so there is no doubt about what is being referred to, would include:

“Publishing defamatory or generally unacceptable* comments, views or information about the Council, its employees, clients or customers (including school pupils) in any medium including social networking sites;

“Publishing any photographs of clients or customers in any medium including social networking sites without first obtaining formal permission;

“Breaching confidentiality by disclosing information relating to the Council in any medium, including social networking sites, to persons not authorised to possess it”.

*Old Susannah is no lawyer, but if you’re going to set out to define what’s ‘unacceptable’ and you use the word ‘unacceptable’ in your first point, you’re not doing a great job. In fact, I’d say it’s ‘unacceptable.’

Again, I’m no lawyer, but it might have been a good idea to mention in these great letters that there is legislation protecting whistleblowers. It doesn’t often protect these people as well as it should, as the Private Eye Whistleblower article points out.

However, if you know of something going on that is wrong, then you should forget all about it because you fear the City’s ‘discipline’ procedure which is mentioned later in the letters. I did not read all of the City’s whistleblower policy – but here is a taster of that policy:-

“…The policy allows individuals to voice their concerns in relation to information they believe shows serious malpractice or wrongdoing within Aberdeen City Council. It allows for this information to be disclosed internally* without fear of reprisal and independently of their line management if appropriate. The Public Interest Disclosure Act (1999) gives legal protection to individuals against being dismissed or penalised by their employers as a result of publicly* disclosing certain serious concerns.”

*Once again Old Susannah is not a lawyer, but on the one hand the City says you can disclose information internally – the act says you can publicly disclose serious concerns. Back to that Council letter :-

“…if you make comment on your employment/employer via social networking sites or by other electronic means and this is brought to the attention of management you will be held to account for those comments. Such behaviour will be viewed as contrary to the Council’s Employee Code of Conduct, which is being updated to reflect this issue and will be dealt with under the Managing Discipline procedure.”

I hope everyone who got a letter is suitably frightened.

So to clarify: in the larger world of the UK, it is acknowledged that there are times when public disclosure is allowable. Here in Aberdeen you have the right to complain internally, and if you go public with something, you will be…disciplined. I’m very glad to have cleared that up. It is just as well nothing ever goes wrong or is untoward in our city.

But if you are one of the lucky letter-holders, you might want to brush up on the Public Disclosure Act – just in case you ever find something in our City is not quite as it should be. (Call me; we’ll talk). Obviously no one would ever make an anonymous Facebook page or blog (whatever that is) and air their grievances anonymously.

Finally, just as proof there are plenty of good news stories out there, not only does the Aberdeen Voice bring them to you, but one of the Voice’s contributors has a rather nice blog.

I guess this blog thing is a ‘social network’ thingy that has the City so very worried. This ‘rxpell’ chap and I often seem to be along similar lines – he’s written things in the past just before I planned to, and has made a nice job of it. (Unfortunately he does tend to veer towards sarcasm and cynicism sometimes – which of course I cannot really approve of). The clues to the blog’s content are in the link below:
http://rxpell.wordpress.com/2011/07/11/blundergate-boilergate-briefgate-buffetgate/

Now off to buy that new outfit and hat for the portrait demonstration – sorry, I mean portrait unveiling.

Next week: probably: still no progress on FOI requests on land deals or deer. Hopefully: Aberdeen Voice art competition announcement. Definitely: more definitions

Old Susannah’s Journal No. 30 – Six Month Review

Articles, Community, Creative Writing, Information, Opinion, Satire and Humour No Responses »

Apr 072011

Voice’s Old Susannah casts her eye over the events of the last 6 months and the stories, and terms and phrases familiar as well as freshly ‘spun’, which will be forever etched in the consciousness of the people of Aberdeen and the Northeast.

As there are so few interesting local, national or international developments in the news lately, (earthquakes, wars, radiation, armed robberies, Aberdeen Council wheeling and dealing notwithstanding), this looks like a good time to look back at some of the terms and issues covered in Old Susannah’s Dictionary Corner over the last six months.
The column looked at Change Managers, Continuous Improvement, Climate Change and Dangerous dog owners and dogfights. What has happened to the heroes, villains, good, bad and the ugly? Well, let’s see…

Animal Crackers

Let’s Go Clubbing:
Cast your mind back – do you remember Donald Forbes, golfer and fox batterer extraordinaire? What’s become of him? First he told us he had clubbed the fox (which was later found in such a horrible state it had to be put down, to the disgust of 99.95% of the members of Forbes’ golf club).

Then Forbes said he was in ‘mortal danger’ from the fox and therefore swung his club near the fox, but did not hit it. How this tame, well-known fox was going to harm Forbes other than stealing a sandwich from him remains unclear. How the fox was injured fatally also remains a mystery, as Forbes says he did not do it.

Sources tell me Forbes will soon have his day in Court – keep your eyes on the Aberdeen court circular during the month of April. Truth will out. Maybe.

Licensed to maim:
Like-minded animal lover, top oilman, and gunslinger Mr Mervyn New, you will remember, took his gun to work and quite rightly shot some horrid gull chicks that had the nerve to be in a nest near him. One bird was dead outright, the other suffered in agony until the SSPCA could have it put down.

Maybe we should all bring guns to work? On the plus side I bet Mr New looks quite macho with a gun. It would be cruel to suggest he might have a complex against his parents for naming him ‘Mervin’ so I shall say nothing on that subject. My emails to his local and head office have gone unanswered or have been returned marked ‘delivery failure’. It is almost as if Marine Subsea UK do not want to set the record straight or answer any questions on their guns-at-work policy. Maybe some of you readers can get an answer out of them. I will try again when I have made progress on…

…The Tullos Hill Roe Deer:
In a style that would make Highwayman robber Dick Turpin blush, the City have told animal lovers to pay up £225k by 10 May, or the deer get shot. It was all most democratic; they voted on it, except they did not bother to mention the cull to the citizens. Scottish Natural Heritage point out unwillingly (see articles elsewhere in the Voice) that alternatives to gunning the deer down do exist. During this ongoing saga

It is heartbreaking to see these dumb animals going about their usual routines, visiting their favourite drinking holes, unaware of the doom awaiting them

Cllr Aileen Malone proved she could not count; she announced that ‘about one’ person in Aberdeen wrote to her against the cull. She later apologised for this understandable mathematical error – but I do not believe her apology was as public as her P&J statement about there only being ‘about one’ objector. I can however say that at least 500 people have signed various petitions and that is a conservative figure (like me).

It is heartbreaking to see these dumb animals going about their usual routines, visiting their favourite drinking holes, unaware of the doom awaiting them. Nevertheless, at the next possible election, there will most definitely be a cull of Councillors.

The Council had handled the proposed tree planting in its time-honoured way; it held a consultation.

Democracy Inaction

Consultation:
That’s right – the City asked us mere citizen taxpayers what we thought of the tree planting on its lovely website, and gave us until the end of this past January to comment. Just because the City forgot to mention the cull is no reason for the consultation not to be valid, after all, without consultation we would not have our design competition coming up for…

…Union Terrace Gardens:
Back at the time how exciting it was – ACSEF were visiting shopping malls and businesses, giving presentations on a wonderful new way of re-imaging the gardens – turning them into a concrete slab with underground parking. Despite producing a brochure (costing about £300k of our money), which showed exactly that type of outcome – large squares of concrete, one or two tiny trees in planters, and happy people walking around in nice weather, the public vote was against it.

Who would have guessed that the public simply did not understand how important this was to Ian Wood’s future, sorry – to our economic prosperity. So, we will get a design competition instead. Someone already got money earmarked for the rival, earlier, clearer, subtler Peacock plan – money which was intended to be used by Peacock.

I was concerned just last week about the coalition as they are fighting at the National level. However, Councillor Irene Cormack wrote to me to say that this is perfectly normal at elections

No one knows anything about how the money was approved for expenditure; no one knows what goes on inside ACSEF (the online minutes do not give any history or details on this saga worth having). And the worst part is, people have actually organised to protest against having shops and parking.

How else will Stewart Milne’s lovely plans for Triple Kirks work? Answers on a postcard please.

The Press & Journal on 6th April continued a welcome new trend – they are questioning the handling of the UTG situation in an excellent editorial well worth reading.

Public Image:
In a past Old Susannah Dictionary Corner, I was heartened to hear that Kate was going to get an image and publicity makeover by the LibDem team who gave the world Nick Clegg. Here we are about three months later, and I think the results speak for themselves. What do you think of the new Kate? I think the results of Nick’s influence speak for themselves.

Kate’s complaint at the time was that people always complain when things are going bad, but they never compliment the City Council when things are going well. I asked readers for examples of things that went well, but have received not so much as a line.

Coalition:
You might remember some months back when I was worried about our local LibDem / SNP Coalition arguing about how many Council jobs to cut. Nine hundred with no consultation? Six Hundred? Ask for ideas? Cut nothing and then keep quiet? Those must have been exciting times for the staff at St Nick’s. I was concerned just last week about the coalition as they are fighting at the National level. However, Councillor Irene Cormack wrote to me to say that this is perfectly normal at elections. I hope nothing will interfere with how things are working here. In fact, soon all will be perfect, once everyone moves into…

…Marischal College:

In fact, she is known to have sent out e-mails claiming victory, because no one has complained/objected to the stadium lately (hint hint!) But it is not over yet, watch this space

Charities are short of funding, schools are closing, and elderly and vulnerable people are at risk from a host of problems. No matter: we saved Marischal College. The Council told us that they will not disclose what the alternatives were or what they would have cost – it is copyrighted so they claim. We saved Marischal by gutting it entirely, throwing Victorian books into a skip (I have a source who confirms this), and we’re putting in brand new furniture. £60 to 80 million well spent I say.

Loirston Loch – a nice place for a game of football:
Despite lack of consultation with the relevant local Councils, little support from Football fans, and opposition from local residents, follically-challenged Stewart Milne (of ACSEF and AFC fame) got the green light to build a red-light stadium in the Greenbelt land of Loirston.

Scottish Natural Heritage weren’t bothered (despite SAC land status, protected species and RSPB objection); Brian Adam MSP was ecstatic, and Richard Baker MSP was ignored.

Kate Dean was the impartial convener of a marathon hearing on the matter, which was always going to end favourably. In fact, she is known to have sent out e-mails claiming victory, because no one has complained/objected to the stadium lately (hint hint!) But it is not over yet, watch this space. If there has not been too much dialogue at present, it is because of the massive legal points being researched prior to the battle royale.

Conclusion – A Brighter Outlook:
The most important thing to remember when considering the recent past is that we now all have A Brighter Outlook. I know this, because the City Council put it in their literature. It is an ACSEF slogan, it is how the City does business, it is all brighter. After all, how much darker can things possibly get?

Next week:
Since ACSEF benefited so much from its new logo and ‘A Brighter Outlook’ slogan, Old Susannah is getting a makeover. I do not know exactly what to expect and what the Voice editors have in mind, I just hope I will come out looking as cool, modern and with it as ACSEF does.

Thanks for reading, and thanks for the very nice/interesting/excellent e-mails and comments.

Old Susannah’s Dictionary No.27 – A Mail Dominated Issue?

Articles, Community, Creative Writing, Information, Opinion, Satire and Humour Comments Off

Mar 112011

Voice’s Old Susannah comments on current events and enlightens us with definitions of some tricky terms with a locally topical taste.

A week is a long time in politics so they say (NB – for some of you Councillors out there, a week is ‘about’ seven days), and poor old John Stewart, our fearless Council Leader, is having quite a week. Not only are people refusing to do as he says (the Church of Scotland are being very mean indeed), but people are also actually questioning him.

Yes, really! He is head of our Council, after all: who are we to question him, whether it be about killing – sorry culling – deer, building stadiums, service cuts or Council job losses?

Old Susannah is against anyone hitting anyone, but a woman has apparently smacked our John when he was out with his partner Neil having a lager shandy in the Kirkgate Bar. Violence is no answer, but the question is what provoked it? I am told she was a council employee. Maybe she just likes parks, deer, schools, services and clean air?

The truth is out there, someone please fill me in … on second thoughts, please, don’t fill me in, just enlighten me.

But my sympathies lie with those brave souls who would try and park at Golden Square. There are about 3 versions of how long you can stay and how much it costs. You would need a lawyer and an accountant to avoid getting a ticket, and our Kate’s been in the news assuring us that the contradictory signs will be looked at some time, and that fines already given out will stand. How much better run the parking is now than a year ago when the meager funds collected for parking in Golden Square went to a deserving charity. The Council shows its usual compassion and logic yet again.

ASBO: (Noun) UK, modern acronym coined under the Blair Government signifying ‘anti-social behaviour order’.

These were given to persistently badly-behaving people (loud music always blaring at night, aggressive or offensive behaviour, what have you) and it was believed an ASBO would shame the wrongdoer into becoming a model citizen. Unfortunately the ASBO instead ‘became a badge of honour for CHAVS (‘Council-Housed and Violent’) and NEDS (‘Non-Educated Delinquents). Acronyms all round then.

Our very own Leader John Stewart says that the Church of Scotland should be given an ASBO. Why you might rightly ask?

This great modern, imaginative look would be so very wonderful in Union Terrace Gardens, I am sure.

Well, the Church did not behave as John wanted it to. That itself is enough to convince me an ASBO is deserved, but for openers, the Church of Scotland would not lower its selling price for Greyfriars Church next to Marischal College to the level John wanted, and the City could not therefore buy it.

As we all know, Aberdeen City Council will sell property to you (if you are a multimillionaire developer) for far less than the market value, so why wouldn’t the Church do the same for the City?

But the Church had gone even farther – it would not clean its granite facade, and it charged the City for swinging a crane over the church when it made the glorious remodeling of Marischal College. I am sure we all agree that with its newly cleaned Granite, Marischal looks splendid. It does not remotely look at all like a sterile, antiseptic giant wedding cake of a building out of sync with its environment. Its loveliness is enhanced by the removal of any trace of greenery (so far anyway) and the addition of a concrete pavement. This great modern, imaginative look would be so very wonderful in Union Terrace Gardens, I am sure.

The Church should have been forced to likewise spend hundreds of thousands of pounds to remove any trace of dirt from its building, even if the dirt makes the architectural features stand out and adds character (antique metal pieces are cherished for their ‘patina’ – and cleaning such an antique lowers its value).

I am sure those people opposed to the deer kill – sorry, I mean cull – are most glad that vast sums of money were spent cleaning Marischal College (not to mention the £80 million allocated to the project in total) and understand that the City cannot find £225k anywhere for fences or plastic for the trees, so will quite rightly kill, I mean cull, the deer.

Funnily enough, it is standard practice to charge a builder for swinging cranes over the top of existing buildings. However, the Church should have known the Council would never have permitted anything to go wrong, and should have waived this usual fee. An ASBO is the least the Church should receive for being mean to John.

we can count on her going back to the Press & Journal to publicly set the record straight. She would, of course, not want to mislead P&J readers

An ASBO can also be used to make a bad neighbour keep their property in good order. So if you know of any person or entity in Aberdeen which fails to maintain property they own – such as pavements being crooked, dangerous and litter-strewn, roads covered with potholes, – do get in touch with your Council and ask for an ASBO to be doled out. Tell them John sent you.

Email: (Verb) To send communication via electronic means to a specified recipient or recipients.

I hear that all the young people today are using email rather than putting pen to paper, but it should be remembered that email does not always get to its desired location (unlike snail mail, which never goes astray).

It is also easy for email to be accidentally ‘deleted’. Such an unfortunate thing happened to our own Councillor Aileen Malone, who accidentally deleted email (including one from me), which showed people living in Aberdeen were opposed to the deer kill -I mean cull. Ms Malone went to the press last week, saying ‘about one’ email from Aberdeen residents were sent to her about the deer slaughter. Now that she knows she had received more, we can count on her going back to the Press & Journal to publicly set the record straight. She would, of course, not want to mislead P&J readers.

It also looks like an electronic communication sent by MSP Richard Baker to object (goodness knows why) to building the Loirston Community Arena Stadium thingy never was received by our planning geniuses. It certainly was not mentioned in the report prepared by the Council for the Loirston hearing, which did manage to quote MSP Adam’s support for the stadium. Reports are reaching Old Susannah that a senior Council official says Richard Baker did not submit an objection in time /did not submit one. I know whom I am inclined to believe – watch this space for further developments.

In summary, email is used to send communication – but if you receive any email you do not want to have or which is inconvenient, just delete it and deny it. No one will ever find out. Simples.

Blackmail: (Verb) To threaten to use force or expose information unless money or other compensation is delivered.

The problem with giving into the demands of blackmailers is that once you start, they will keep on blackmailing you forever

Blackmail is illegal of course. A kidnapper may threaten to kill – sorry, cull – an innocent hostage unless demands are met. A City Council may threaten to kill – sorry cull , a number of tame, blameless, innocent, beautiful deer in order to plant trees (which could be planted anywhere) unless animal lovers come up with £225K by a deadline.

Personally I think this is the most innovative thinking to come out of the Council in ages. The City could start using this tactic elsewhere. Maybe they could threaten to close schools, shed jobs and services unless they get more money.

The problem with giving into the demands of blackmailers is that once you start, they will keep on blackmailing you forever. The problem with giving a wasteful institution more money is that they will keep wasting money on frivolous, self-aggrandizing projects (squares, shopping malls, grandiose offices with new state-of-the-art features and new furniture) while the people whose needs are greater suffer.

Does this Council need more money – or does it need more common sense, compassion and humility? (At least we will take comfort knowing that whatever is going on, Kate Dean still finds time to attend a dozen or so shows at the AECC a year. I am still thinking what a night it must have been for Neil Young when she attended his show – did he get a chance to meet her I wonder? What are her favourite Neil Young songs? Top must be ‘Proud to be a Union Man’).

If the shoe were on the other foot and a population grew weary of its bungling elected officials, blackmail could also be used: ‘Represent our views, give us decent services and clean, safe streets – or we will vote you out of office’. Not a pleasant thought, is it?

Diversion (1): (Noun) A re-routing of traffic to enable emergency works or repairs to take place.

A diversion should take in as many side roads and eat up as much petrol and time as possible, and should not distract a driver with unnecessary signage – they will eventually figure out where they are. A diversion say from one end of Berryden to the other might take in a few hospitals and be routed on narrow back streets.

Diversion (2): (Noun) To deflect attention or resources from one area to another, often to cover up any error or bad practice.

Only the worst kind of cynic would suggest that recent press announcements concerning Sir Ian Wood pledging £400k or so towards a Union Terrace Gardens Trust (of some sort or other) and Scottish Enterprise pledging likewise towards turning UTG into a much-needed parking lot are a diversion.

What would Sir I and SE want to divert attention from? Surely not the emerging story that money, which had been earmarked for the Peacock project – some £375k – was actually spent on the rival plan backed by ACSEF, Stew Milne and Sir I? No – I am certain SE, ACSEF, Sir I and Stew all want to find out and bring to light just how this money was diverted from Peacock – they do not want to divert your attention from this little matter at all.

Truth will out; even if ACSEF still refuse to hand over its meeting minutes to me. I could send them another FOI request, but banging my head against the wall or talking to a lamppost would be more fruitful. If any readers out there would like to contact ACSEF or SE and ask for copies of meeting minutes where Peacock, UTG, and funding were discussed, please do be my guest.